The Phillips, Weber, Kirk, & Staggs families of the Pacific Northwest

Entries: 46457    Updated: 2015-06-11 05:23:07 UTC (Thu)    Owner: Jim Weber

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  • ID: I39525
  • Name: Madog ap Dafydd de HENDOUR , Baron of Edeirnion
  • Sex: M
  • ALIA: Madog ap /Dafydd/, Baron of Hendwr
  • Birth: ABT 1270 in Edeirnion, Denbighshire, Wales
  • Death: Deceased in Hendwr, Llandrillo, Denbighshire, Wales
  • Note:
    I got my ancestry for Madog de Hendour from Richard Hodgson (world connect db=ancestorsearch), who was following Tim Sandberg (world connect db=sandberg). Also from the website www.hunterscastle.com, who had a page on the "Hender, Hendour, or Hendower Families of Wales". Also from the well researched (especially for Wales) line of Vanessa Weber (world connect db=veryflatcat3). All pretty much agree with Madog's ancestry.

    However Leo Van de Pas, in his genealogics website, has a completely different ancestry for Madog. Leo was giving the ancestry for the Tudors (Henry VII, etc.), and did not mention the Hendower/Hendour connection, nor Gwenllian Lloyd. However Madog was supposedly involved with both the Tudors and Hendowers.

    The only two things that the two Madogs have in common is a male descent from Madog ap Maredudd, King of Powys (although by different sons), and a marriage to Eva/Efa Llewelyn ap Gruffudd ap Gwenwynwyn. I have Eva/Efa married to both versions of Madog (one for the Tudor ancestry and the other for the Hendower ancestry), as I am uncertain as to which is correct.

    Leo usually has excellent sources, so one might tend to go with his ancestry for Gwervil (Gwerfyl), wife of Gronwy ap Tudor (see notes for Eva's "other" husband Madog for Leo's source). However an article in wikipaedia on "Goronwy ap Tudur Hen" (my Gronwy ap Tudor) states that the wife of "Goronwy ap Tudur Hen (d.1338), Lord of Penmynydd was "Gwerfyl ferch Madog, daughter of Madog ap Dafydd, Baron of Hendwr", which supports the hunterscastle version of her ancestry. The sources given by the wikipaedia article are:
    1. Bezzant Lowe, Walter (1912). The Heart of Northern Wales. Llanfairfechan. p354.
    2. Beirdd yr Uchelwyr Published by Canolfan Uwchefrydiau Cymreig a Cheltaidd Prifysgol Cymru, 1995; ISBN 0-947531-09-2.

    Of course it is possible both lines are correct, the hunterscastle website states that possibly Madog, father of David Hendower, did not marry both wives (maybe just Gwenlian Lloyd); and Leo's website only gives the Tudor descent (not the Hendower descent) nor does it give a wife other than Eva verch Llewelyn ap Gruffudd ap Gwenwynwyn. So maybe the mistake is that Gwervil verch Madog of the Tudor line was not a sister of David Hendower, but daughter of a different Madog. In which case, just erasing the marriage of Eva/Efa to Madog ap Daffyd Hendour would make it correct. The "Hendwr" in Leo's website naming of the other "Madog o'r Hendwr ab Iorwerth" may just be a coincidence (not likely!).

    See notes for Eva's "other" husband Madog.

    ------------

    Madog de Hendour, Lord of Hendwr, was of the 'hen' (old) - 'dour' (tower). He either had one or two wives. The one being reported as Eva verch Llewelyn ab Gruffyd ab Gwenwynwyn and the other being Gwenlian Lloyd the daughter of Sir Gruffydd Lloyd. The children of Madog de Hendour are:

    David de Hendour, Baron of Edernion. He marries Margaret de Cornwall and who's family relocates to Cornwall becoming the ancestor of the Henders of Cornwall.
    Gruffydd ab Madog of Hendwr.
    Rhys ab Madog of Hendwr.
    Gwerfyl verch Madog of Hendwr who marries Tudor ab Goronwy and becomes the Welsh ancestors of the TUDOR Royal House of England.

    [Hender, Hendour, or Hendower Families of Wales, www.hunterscastle.com]




    Father: Dafydd (David) ap GRUFFUDD , of Crogen b: ABT 1210 in Edeirnion, Denbighshire, Wales
    Mother: Eva verch LLEWELYN b: ABT 1235 in Eyton, Wrexham, Denbighshire, Wales

    Marriage 1 Gwenllian LLOYD b: ABT 1290 in Hendrefeinws, Abererch, Caernarvonshire, Wales
      Children
      1. Has Children David de HENDOWER b: ABT 1305 in Hendwr, Llandrillo, Denbighshire, Wales

      Marriage 2 Efa verch LLEWELYN b: ABT 1270 in Powis Castle, Welshpool, Montgomeryshire, Wales
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