The Phillips, Weber, Kirk, & Staggs families of the Pacific Northwest

Entries: 46457    Updated: 2015-06-11 05:23:07 UTC (Thu)    Owner: Jim Weber

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  • ID: I36111
  • Name: William CURWEN , of Workington, Sir 1 2
  • Sex: M
  • Birth: ABT 1350 in Workington, Cockermouth, Cumberland, England
  • Death: 1403 3 4
  • Note:
    NOTE: Ancestral Roots, RD500, & many other sources state that the 2nd wife, Margaret Croft was the mother of Christopher, however a post to SGM argues differently, as seen below.

    The following is part of a post to SGM by Tim Cartmell, 28 Aug 2007:

    Regarding Sir William Culwen [Curwen] of Workington, he had two wives, 1stly Elena le Brun, and 2ndly Margaret Croft. All three of the aforementioned Curwen family histories state this.

    I believe where the idea originated that Margaret Croft was the mother of Sir William's sons, was from the burial monument at St. Michael's Church in Workington. On the monument are the arms for Curwen impaling Croft, and as such, I think an assumption has been made that this meant she was the mother. William Jackson also stated in his book that Margaret Croft was the mother of Sir William's two sons, and that she was the second wife.

    On the other hand, Rev. Frederick W. Ragg put his mind to this problem, and argued against Margaret Croft being the mother. He stated that Margaret Croft was the second wife of Sir William, and therefore could not possibly have been the mother of Christopher Curwen. Ragg stated that Elena was a widow when she married Sir William (sometime after 1369) and that she was still living in 1394 (proven by her claim against Sir Nicholas Harington). He went on to state that even if Sir William did marry Margaret Croft in the same year 1394, it could not be possible that she was the mother of Christopher, because he is recorded as being burgess of Appleby in 21 Richard II (1397-1398). Ragg further argued, Christopher had to be of age (21 yrs.) in 1403, as he wasn't held as a minor in custody of the Percies, and he had possession of his father's lands. Ragg also stated that Christopher would have to be of considerable experience, strength and reputation to be one of the six english champions chosen to fight six scottish knights, in tournament at Carlisle in the year 1417. Finally, JF Curwen in his book, shows that Christopher is first named as being lord Christopher Curwen, Knt. in a land settlement regarding the manor of Thornthwaite in Westmorland, dated 1404. Sir Christopher Curwen was named Knight of the Shire of Cumberland firstly in 1414, and then Sheriff of Cumberland in 1415, etc.

    Maybe the Croft coat of arms on the tomb at St. Michael's church, just simply meant that she was the last wife of Sir William Culwen [Curwen]?




    Father: Gilbert CULWEN , of Workington, Sir b: ABT 1330 in Workington, Cockermouth, Cumberland, England
    Mother: Alice LOWTHER b: ABT 1330 in Lowther, West Ward, Westmorland, England

    Marriage 1 Elena le BRUN b: ABT 1350 in Drumburgh Castle, Bowness, Cumberland, England
    • Married: AFT 1369 in 2nd husband 1st wife 5
    Children
    1. Has Children Christopher CURWEN , of Workington, Sir b: BEF 1382 in Workington, Cockermouth, Cumberland, England

    Marriage 2 Margaret CROFT b: ABT 1380 in Claughton, Lancashire, England
    • Married: AFT 1394 in 2nd wife 6 7
    Children
    1. Has Children John CURWEN , Constable of Porchester Castle b: ABT 1396 in Workington, Cockermouth, Cumberland, England

    Sources:
    1. Title: Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists, 7th Edition, by Frederick Lewis Weis, additions by Walter Lee Shippard Jr., 1999
      Page: 37-31
    2. Title: The Royal Descents of 500 Immigrants to the American Colonies or the United States, by Gary Boyd Roberts, 1993
      Page: 416
    3. Title: Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists, 7th Edition, by Frederick Lewis Weis, additions by Walter Lee Shippard Jr., 1999
      Page: 37-31
      Text: living 1403
    4. Title: Newsgroup: soc.genealogy.medieval, at groups - google.com
      Page: Tim Cartmell, 8 Aug 2007
      Text: William, his father Gilbert & two brothers died of the plague in 1403
    5. Title: Newsgroup: soc.genealogy.medieval, at groups - google.com
      Page: Tim Cartmell, 8 Aug 2007
    6. Title: Newsgroup: soc.genealogy.medieval, at groups - google.com
      Page: 37-31
      Text: no date, 2nd wife
    7. Title: Newsgroup: soc.genealogy.medieval, at groups - google.com
      Page: Tim Cartmell, 28 Aug 2007
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