The Phillips, Weber, Kirk, & Staggs families of the Pacific Northwest

Entries: 46457    Updated: 2015-06-11 05:23:07 UTC (Thu)    Owner: Jim Weber

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  • ID: I34655
  • Name: Alice de LACY , Heiress of Kippax 1 2 3
  • Sex: F
  • Birth: ABT 1182 in Kippax, Tedcaster, Yorkshire West Riding, England
  • Death: BEF 1209
  • Note:
    The following is an excerpt from an e-mail from Alex Stewart, which caused me to change Alan's first wife (I originally had her as a daughter of Hugh de Lacy following AR):

    Regarding Alan of Galloway's wife, I am still wondering, despite all the contributions to the medieval website, who she was! I note you have as his second wife Miss de Lacy c1194, daughter of Hugh de Lacy, Earl of Ulster. I am looking for the wife who was the mother of Helen of Galloway. I thought she was Helen of the Isles.

    In the Ox. DNB it states the following: "Alan contracted three marriages: to a daughter of Roger de Lacy, to Margaret of Huntingdon...and to Rose, daughter of Hugh de Lacy. The first two marriages produced children, but only daughters attained adulthood. Helen, his daughter by his first marriage married Roger de Quincey." It seems this is also Richardson's view, supported by Hans Vogels who gave Roger's daughter the name Alice. I know there has been a lot of argument about this one, but I have changed from Helen as first wife to (Alice) de Lacy and the dates seem to fit. What do you think? (I notice Leo has no child from the marriage with Rose or Rohese de Lacy, Helen there is the daughter of a NN mother and Richard de Crevequor)

    -------------------

    NOTE: There has been a lot of squabbling in SGM concerning the identity of Alan's 1st wife. Kevin Bradford found documents identifying Richard Crevequor as father-in-law of "John of Chester", who was brother of the wife of Alan of Galloway. He interpreted this as making John of Chester some other person than John de Lacy, Constable of Chester, and making Alan of Galloway's 1st wife a daughter of Richard Crevequor. Douglas Richardson has attempted to do an exhaustive search to prove that John de Lacy was the only person who could have been identified as "John of Chester". Obviously such an exhaustive search is impossible to complete, however he supplied enough reasoning to John's identity to sway me, along with Douglas's pointing to the descent of the Manor of Kippax as proof of his 1st wife's ancestry. Many sources identify Alan's 1st wife as a daughter of Roger de Lacy, which I will follow until more proof is given. Alex Stewart names her Alice, according to Hans Vogels, in the above e-mail.




    Father: John FitzRichard Constable of CHESTER b: ABT 1150 in Halton Castle, Runcorn, Cheshire, England
    Mother: Alice de VERE b: ABT 1152 in Rayleigh, Rochford, Essex, England

    Marriage 1 Alan of GALLOWAY , Constable of Scotland b: ABT 1188 in Galloway, Dumfries and Galloway, Scotland
    • Married: ABT 1200 in 1st wife 4 5 6
    Children
    1. Has Children Helen (Ellen) of GALLOWAY b: ABT 1208 in Leuchars, Fifeshire, Scotland

    Sources:
    1. Title: Newsgroup: soc.genealogy.medieval, at groups - google.com
      Page: Douglas Richardson, 12 Sep 2002
      Text: no first name given, mother of Ellen/Helen
    2. Title: Magna Carta Ancestry, by Douglas Richardson, 2005, Genealogical Publishing Co.
      Page: 685
      Text: no first name given, mother of Ellen/Helen
    3. Title: Magna Charta Sureties 1215, Frederick Lewis Weis, additions by Walter Lee Sheppard Jr, 5th Edition, 1999
      Page: 139-1
      Text: no first name given
    4. Title: Newsgroup: soc.genealogy.medieval, at groups - google.com
      Page: Douglas Richardson, 12 Sep 2002
    5. Title: Magna Carta Ancestry, by Douglas Richardson, 2005, Genealogical Publishing Co.
      Page: 685
      Text: no date, 1st wife
    6. Title: Magna Charta Sureties 1215, Frederick Lewis Weis, additions by Walter Lee Sheppard Jr, 5th Edition, 1999
      Page: 139-1
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