The Phillips, Weber, Kirk, & Staggs families of the Pacific Northwest

Entries: 46457    Updated: 2015-06-11 05:23:07 UTC (Thu)    Owner: Jim Weber

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  • ID: I07703
  • Name: Joan de GREY 1 2
  • Sex: F
  • Birth: ABT 1260 in Wilton Castle, Ross-on-Wye, Herefordshire, England
  • Death: BEF 1285 3
  • Note:
    The following post to SGM, 13 Jan 2002, by Douglas Richardson identifies Joan as Edmund's first wife. [A post by Douglas Richardson in the following week removes Isolde/Iseult as Joan & Edmund's daughter, making her daughter of Hugh de Mortimer & Agatha de Ferrers. See notes under Isolde/Iseult de Mortimer, b. 1265, for that posting]:

    From: Douglas Richardson (royalancestry AT msn.com)
    Subject: Joan, 1st wife of Sir Edmund de Mortimer (died 1304)
    Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
    Date: 2002-01-13 02:22:43 PST

    Dear Newsgroup ~

    I recently came across four legal cases in the Year Books of King Edward I which appear to identify the hitherto unidentified first wife of Sir Edmund de Mortimer (died 1302), of Wigmore, co. Hereford. The unknown first wife is thought to have been the mother of Sir Edmund's daughter, Iseult de Mortimer, wife of Hugh de Audley, from whom many colonial immigrants are descended.

    Although the particulars provided in the legal cases are less than desireable, the first legal case presented below indicates that Sir Edmund's wife's name was Joan. A pedigree is set forth in which Joan is identified as the daughter of Maud, who in turn is said to be the daughter of "W.", which "W." was in turn called brother and heir of Henry.

    Curiously, the wording of the pedigree in the first Mortimer case seems to be a near exact match to two other suits in the same Hereford iter which involve property held by Sir Reynold de Grey, of Wilton, co. Hereford, and his wife, Maud de Longchamp. In one of these suits, Maud de Longchamp is identified as the daughter of "W.", which "W." in turn is identified as the brother and heir of a certain Henry. In both the Mortimer and Grey cases, the said "Henry" is stated to have received his lands by grant of King Richard. In the Mortimer suit, the King demands the manor of "C." against Edmund de Mortimer and Joan his wife. The Prior of "E." is said to hold the advowson. In one of the Grey suits, the king demands the manor of "C." against Reynold and Maud de Grey, the advowson of which property is held by the Prior of "C."

    Since the particulars in the Mortimer and Grey suits are similar in virtually every point, it seems highly probable that Sir Edmund de Mortimer's wife, Joan, is in fact the daughter of Sir Reynold de Grey and his wife, Maud de Longchamp.

    The chronology seems to work o.k. for this identification of Edmund de Mortimer's wife. Research indicates that Edmund de Mortimer was born about 1252, being aged 30 at his father's death in 1282. Sir Reynold de Grey was born say 1230/5, and married before 1257 to Maud de Longchamp, the heiress of Wilton, co. Hereford. As such, it seems entirely possible that Sir Edmund de Mortimer's wife, Joan, was the daughter of Sir Reynold de Grey.




    Father: Reynold 1st Baron de GREY , of Wilton, Sir b: ABT 1236 in Shirland, Derbyshire, England
    Mother: Maud de LONGCHAMP , Heiress of Wilton b: ABT 1240 in Wilton Castle, Ross-on-Wye, Herefordshire, England

    Marriage 1 Edmund 1st Baron de MORTIMER , 7th Lord Wigmore b: BEF 30 OCT 1252 in Wigmore, Ludlow, Herefordshire, England
    • Married: in 1st wife 2 4

    Sources:
    1. Title: Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists, 7th Edition, by Frederick Lewis Weis, additions by Walter Lee Shippard Jr., 1999
      Page: 9-30, 207-30
      Text: Margaret de Fiennes was not the mother of Isolde, but Edmund de Mortimer was the father.
    2. Title: Newsgroup: soc.genealogy.medieval, at groups - google.com
      Page: Douglas Richardson, 13 Jan 2002
    3. Title: Magna Charta Sureties 1215, Frederick Lewis Weis, additions by Walter Lee Sheppard Jr, 5th Edition, 1999
      Page: 147-4
      Text: death implied by remarriage date of Edmund
    4. Title: Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists, 7th Edition, by Frederick Lewis Weis, additions by Walter Lee Shippard Jr., 1999
      Page: 9-30, 207-30
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