The Phillips, Weber, Kirk, & Staggs families of the Pacific Northwest

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  • ID: I04939
  • Name: Ranulph de GLANVILLE , Justiciar of England 1 2
  • Sex: M
  • Birth: ABT 1120 in Stratford St Andrew, Plomesgate, Suffolk, England
  • Death: BEF 21 OCT 1190 in Seige of Acre, Palestine 3
  • Note:
    Ranulph had 3 daughters, who were all coheirs, and no sons.

    Founded Abbey of Butley.
    Chief Justiciar of England during King Henry II.
    Ambassador to Flanders.
    Sheriff of Yorkshire, Westmorland, & Lancaster

    --------------------------------------

    Note: Even though the Glanville family of Suffolk was described in some totaly false pedigrees as "Earls of Suffolk", the Glanvilles were not even a prominent family at that time. They were relatively minor nobles with moderate holdings in Suffolk. Ranulph being the first of the family with any prominence.

    The following posting was in soc.genealogy.medieval in response to a query about the Glanville "Earls of Suffolk", which is written about by Wm. Urmston S. Glanville-Richards, Esq. in 'Records of the Anglo Norman House of Glanville from AD 1050 to 1880', who describes three "Earls of Suffolk", which is totally false, and is described as "a classic example [e.g.] of 19th century antiquarian mayhem - built from a mass of unquestionably invaluable Glanville source material assembled into a dismally ill-considered narrative/pedigree. (The most blatant and - because it is so patently berserk - ultimately least crucial example being his persistently calling Ran(d)ulph, William and Gilbert de Glanville the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd 'Earls of Suffolk' when no such earldom existed). [Christopher Nash, 1 Sep 1998 posting to soc.genealogy.medieval newsgroup]":

    From: Richard Borthwick (rgbor AT cyllene.uwa.edu.au)
    Subject: Re: Glanville line dead-ends before it really begins....
    Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
    Date: 2000/04/06

    Ranulph de Ganville (d.1190) was justiciar of England (but not earl of Sussex). His father was Hervey de Glanville (d.>1166), of Bawdsey and his mother was Mabel. His wife was Bertha dau. of Theobald de Valognes, of Parham Suffolk. Hervey's precise ancestry is problematic but is thought that he was the son of Robert (d.about 1150) son of Roger son of Robert noted in the Domesday survey.

    Ranulph had three daughters and co-heirs: Matilda wife of William d'Auberville, Amabilla wife of Ralph de Aderne and Helewise wife of Robert fitz Ralph, of Middleham, Yorks.

    References:
    Mortimer, R "The Family of Rannulf de Glanville" *Bulletin of the Institute of Historical Research* LIV (1981) 1-16;

    S J Bailey "Ranulf de Glanvill and his Children" *Cambridge Law Journal* (1957) 163-182;
    ibid. "Ranulf de Glanville in Yorkshire" (1958) 178-198;

    West, F J *The Justiciarship in England 1066-1232* (Cambridge U P, 1966) 54; DNB VII:1292-1294;

    K S B Keats-Rohan *Domesday People: A Prosopography of Persons occurring in English Documents,
    1066-1166* (The Boydell Press: Woodbridge, 1999) I:376;

    G Paget *An Official Genealogical and Heraldic Baronage of England* 3 vols. (Manuscript, pre-1957, in the Principal Probate Registry, Somerset House, Strand, London), fam. no.11;

    VCH Yorks NR I:218-219, 274, 378.

    ----------------------------------------------------------

    From: rphair AT my-deja.com (rphair AT my-deja.com)
    Subject: Glanville line dead-ends before it really begins....
    Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
    Date: 2000/05/16


    Kevan Barton and Kay Allen asked about Ranulf de Glanville's ancestry.

    Ranulf de Glanville, appointed justiciar by king Henry II sometime during 1179-1180 [1], was never created an earl. His family's lands were in Norfolk and Suffolk counties and were of only minor importance[2]. Very little is known about his ancestry.

    His father was Hervey de Glanville who was living 1148-53 and, perhaps, was still alive in 1166 or later [2]. Hervey was born in the 1090s or earlier, as implied by his speech at a local court [2]. Using an unspecified source, Mortimer claimed Hervey married Mabel -- [3].

    Mortimer thought Hervey was the son of Robert de Glanville (alive c.1140) based upon two Coxford priory records [3]. The first one was an agreement dated by Mortimer, without explanation, as probably 1171 [4]; Hervey's confirmation of that agreement was the second record. Other records indicate Ranulf had probably succeeded before 1166 [2,6].

    Mortimer's assumption that Robert was identical to the Robert who appears in charters of 1140-5 and c.1150 with his father Roger de Glanville [2] is chronologically implausible -- Roger, according to Mortimer's version, would have been Ranulf de Glanville's great- grandfather and at least 90 years old in 1140. The latter charter, if Mortimer's interpretation is accepted, would have had the unlikely situation of Ranulf (long before he was prominent) appearing in the witness list after his father but before his great-grandfather and grandfather. A more tenable identification of the Roger in these charters would be Hervey's brother Roger who had a son Robert [5,3].

    An earlier Ranulf de Glanville and his successor Hervey de Glanville were benefactor and witness of Robert Malet's Eye priory during its foundation period 1086-1105/6 [6]. Their names and the observation that the justiciar and his father were witnesses of charters for the priory, suggests there might be a connection between the justiciar's family and these earlier Glanvilles.

    The other Glanville family in 12th- and 13th-century east Anglia were descendants of William de Glanville who founded Bromholm priory in 1113 [3,7]. William and his descendants held some of the estates which had formerly been held by Robert de Glanville, a Domesday tenant of Robert Malet. Its not known whether Robert had any children, but it seems likely that William was a relative. Hervey with his son Ranulf (the future justiciar) witnessed a few charters for this other Glanville family, but the relationship, if any, between these two families has not been determined.

    For more information about Ranulf's wife and 3 daughters see my 21 Feb 1999 posting "Ranulf de Glanville" (in which #6 Roger should have been numbered #8 and #8 Robert should have been #16).

    [1] F. West, "The justiciarship in England 1066-1232", 1966, pp.53, 55-6.
    [2] "Liber Eliensis", ed. E. O. Blake, 1962, no.133 and pp.408-9; H.M. Cam, English Historical Review 39:568-571 (1924); "Red book of the exchequer", ed. H. Hall, 1:365, 393, 396 (1896); "The Crawford Collection", ed. A.S. Napier and W.H. Stevenson, 1895, no.16 and p.152; Norfolk Record Soc.(NRS), 2:no.161 (1932), ed. J.R. West.
    [3] R. Mortimer, Bulletin of the Institute of Historical Research, 54:1-16 (1981).
    [4] Cf. D. Knowles, et al., "The heads of religious houses", 1972, p.161.
    [5] S.J. Bailey, Cambridge Law Journal 10:84-103 (1948).
    [6] "Eye priory cartulary and charters", ed. V. Brown, 1:nos.1,15,23,73, 346; 2:58 (1992-4).
    [7] W. Farrer, "Honors and knights' fees", 3:424; J.S. Falls, Mediaeval Studies 40:312-327 (1978); NRS 3:212-3.

    Ray Phair




    Father: Hervey de GLANVILLE , of Bawdsey, Sir b: ABT 1095 in Bawdsey, Woodbridge, Suffolk, England
    Mother: Maud (Matilda\Mabel) b: ABT 1098

    Marriage 1 Bertha de VALOINES b: ABT 1125 in Parham, Plomesgate, Suffolk, England
      Children
      1. Has Children Maud (Matilda) de GLANVILLE b: ABT 1143 in Bowsley, Antley, Suffolk, England
      2. Has Children Hawise (Helewise) de GLANVILLE b: ABT 1148 in Stratford St Andrew, Plomesgate, Suffolk, England

      Sources:
      1. Title: The Plantagenet Ancestry, by William Henry Turton, 1968
        Page: 123
      2. Title: Butler Family History, 7th Edition 1991, by Lord Dunboyne, Kilkenny Castle Book Shop
        Page: 5
      3. Title: The Plantagenet Ancestry, by William Henry Turton, 1968
        Page: 123
        Text: 1191
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