The Phillips, Weber, Kirk, & Staggs families of the Pacific Northwest

Entries: 46457    Updated: 2015-06-11 05:23:07 UTC (Thu)    Owner: Jim Weber

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  • ID: I00240
  • Name: Crinan the Thane Lay Abbot of DUNKELD 1 2 3
  • Sex: M
  • ALIA: Crinan the /Thane/, Lay Abbot of Dunkeld
  • Birth: 978 in Dunkeld, Perthshire, Scotland 4 5
  • Death: 1045 in Killed in Battle against Macbeth, who (1040) slew his son Duncan 4 3
  • Note:
    Crinan; Lay Abbot of Dunkeld; married c1000 Bethoc, elder daughter of Malcolm II, and was killed 1045 in battle against Macbeth (the historic figure who murdered Crinan's elder son Duncan I, and subsequently is portrayed as having usurped the Scottish throne, most famously by Shakespeare), leaving (Maldred), with an elder son (Duncan I "The Gracious" King of Scots 1034-40; ancestor of the Sovereigns of England and later England, Ireland, Scotland, Great Britain, etc.). [Burke's Peerage]

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    Crinan the Thane (Albanock, Grimus), of the kin of St. Columba, Lord of the Isles, Governor of Scots Island, Earl of Strathclye, hereditary Abbot of Dunkeld.

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    The following additional information was given in a post-em by Curt Hofemann, curt_hofemann AT yahoo.com:

    given name spelled: Crínán [Ref: Henry Project]

    Lay Abbot of Dunkeld, Governor of the Scots Islands [Ref: Weis AR7 170:19]
    Heriditary Abbott of Dunkeld, or the Kindred of St. Columba [Ref: Royal Highness: Ancestors of the Royal Child by Sir Ian Moncreiffe, 1982, Hamish Hamilton, London Pg 20] note: "or the kindred of" = ? Either was or wasn't... Curt

    In what was probably a shrewd political move, Malcolm II married his daughter Bethoc to a representative of the other major center of political power in Scotland, the church. Considering the close ties between ruling dynasties and the offices of major abbacies throughout Ireland and Scotland, it is also possible that Crinan was descended from a king of the Scots, which would completely legitimize his son's rule. [Ref: The Genealogy of the Early Medieval Scottish Kings, Edinburgh by Michael R. Davidson 1995, Holland House, Edinburgh, Scotland]

    Malcolm's elder daughter Bethoc married Crinan 'the Thane', lay abbot of Dunkeld. At this period, when Celtic Monasticism was in decline, lay abbots appear to have been as accepted a part of the ecclesiastical structure as they became centuries later on the eve of the Reformation. Crinan was a great nobleman, as his title implies, and he possessed the added prestige of belonging to the kindred of St. Columba. It was from his abbacy of Dunkeld that the new royal House took its name, for Crinan and Bethoc were the parents of King Duncan I...Meanwhile, Macbeth consolidated his triumph by defeating and slaying Duncan's father, Crinan, in a battle at Dunkeld in 1045. [Ref: The Kings and Queens of Scotland] note: sorry, I sourced this early-on before I realized one also has to list author, publisher, date, etc.-we get too soon old & too late smart... Curt

    Macbeth...probably a grandson of Malcolm II...asserted his claim to the throne against Duncan I, whom he killed near Elgin. In 1045 he killed Crinan, Duncan's father in battle, but in 1057 he was himself killed by Duncan's son, Malcolm Canmore (Malcolm III). [Ref: A Dictionary of British History by J.P. Kenyon, 1983 Stein and Day, Scarborough House, Briarcliff Manor, NY]

    Research note: Supposed father: Since the abbacy of Dunkeld appears to have been hereditary in Crínán's family (his grandson Æthelred held the title), it has sometimes been suggested that Crínán may have been the son of this earlier abbot of Dunkeld whose death is known form both the Irish and Scottish sources [e.g., AU; ESSH 1: 471, 473, 577; KKES 252]. While the relationship is not impossible (assuming that Crínán's father died when he was an infant), there is no known evidence to support it, and it cannot be accepted without further evidence [Ref: Henry Project citing:

    AU = Seán Mac Airt and Gearóid Mac Niocaill, The Annals of Ulster, Dublin, 1983
    ESSH = Alan Orr Anderson, Early Sources of Scottish History, 2 vols. (Edinburgh, 1922, reprinted Stamford, 1990)
    KKES = Marjorie Ogilvy Anderson, Kings and Kingship in Early Scotland (Edinburgh, Totowa, NJ, 1973)]

    Jim, I recommend highly the Henry Project of which I've prevously supplied the URL. If you've not already, spend some time there. A most realistic scholarly work. He even debunks some connections common all over the internet & explains why. Quite a refreshing change from the normal junk genealogy that is these days prevalent. Not to condemn today's amateur genealogists - junk genealogy is not new - look at some of the earlier genealogies of the Habsburgs linking them back to the Old Testament (depending on which genalogist at the time, in different ways).

    Regards,
    Curt




    Father: Duncan Lay Abbot of DUNKELD b: ABT 949 in Dunkeld, Perthshire, Scotland
    Mother: NN of the ISLES b: ABT 950 in Scotland

    Marriage 1 Bethoc (Beatrix) Princess of SCOTLAND b: ABT 984 in Atholl, Perthshire, Scotland
    • Married: 1000 4 3
    Children
    1. Has Children Duncan I MacCrinan King of SCOTLAND b: 1001 in Atholl, Perthshire, Scotland
    2. Has Children Maldred Lord of Carlisle & ALLERDALE b: 1003 in Allerdale, Cumbria, England
    3. Has Children Daughter of Crinan Lay Abbot of DUNKELD b: ABT 1010 in Atholl, Perthshire, Scotland

    Sources:
    1. Title: Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists, 7th Edition, by Frederick Lewis Weis, additions by Walter Lee Shippard Jr., 1999
      Page: 34-21, 170-19
    2. Title: Burke's Peerage & Baronetage, 106th Edition, Charles Mosley Editor-in-Chief, 1999
      Page: 895
      Text: Crinan Lay Abbot of Dunkeld
    3. Title: The Plantagenet Ancestry, by William Henry Turton, 1968
      Page: 21
    4. Title: Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists, 7th Edition, by Frederick Lewis Weis, additions by Walter Lee Shippard Jr., 1999
      Page: 170-19
    5. Title: The Plantagenet Ancestry, by William Henry Turton, 1968
      Page: 21
      Text: actually appears like 798, but I think it means 978
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